Ikael Tafari and Nation News Declare Jesus Resurrection As Fraud – He Had A Twin Brother, Etc Etc Etc.

It’s no problem for me what anyone says about Jesus.

Folks can make the most foul statements or draw the most foul Jesus cartoons. I remain a Christian and am convinced that Jesus is well able to look after himself in the face of all sorts of attacks.

My point is this…

The Nation News has published Ikael Tafari’s African Crossroads: Crucifixion Of Truth (1) in a vastly Christian Barbados – knowing that the article will offend, and also knowing that the sum total of response from Christians is likely to be some letters and phone calls, and perhaps some calls for prayer for Tafari and the editors.

Would The Nation News now kindly publish the Mohammad cartoons or some other article as deeply offensive to Muslims as Ikael Tafari’s article is to Christians?

The editors at The Nation News are Cowardly lapdogs.

About That Government Position Enjoyed By Tafari…

Don’t expect Prime Minister Owen Arthur’s government to remove the government tax funding or Ikael Tafari from the Commission for Pan-African Affairs. Pretty well anything goes here in Barbados as long as you don’t threaten the profits of Owen and the gang.

67 Comments

Filed under Africa, Barbados, Culture & Race Issues, Religion

67 responses to “Ikael Tafari and Nation News Declare Jesus Resurrection As Fraud – He Had A Twin Brother, Etc Etc Etc.

  1. Chase

    Folks can make the most foul statements or draw the most foul Jesus cartoons. I remain a Christian and am convinced that Jesus is well able to look after himself in the face of all sorts of attacks.

    You have your opinion,others have theirs…this is what makes this world unique.
    Hopefully,one of these days the truth will be revealed to us all …..until then we have to live in this diverse world.

  2. akabozik

    Let the Nation publish the Mohammed cartoons.

    See what happens then!

  3. akabozik

    See what happens to Chase’s “diverse” world then!

  4. DFX

    Chase,

    Look at how you gone and get chew out on the 1st post LOL. Boy, had to help out my Dad with a computer problem and his computer is up 2 flights of stairs. Going up is easy, but de going back down, man dis damn ankle swell up again (But I’ve taken a leave from our gracious hosts here and sent the wife for a six pack. I’m in training for our session with Bajan reporter)

    I’m looking forward to reading Kairo’s take on this one 😉

    Take care my friend.

    DFX

  5. noreligion

    bfp’s obsessions- islam, cuba, venezuela, ikael, abortion, race

  6. Straight talk

    Noreligion, I can feel a “set up a WordPress blog in 15 mins” coming on, try it and check your judgement against BFP’s

  7. Chase

    DFX:

    Take it easy man,I still endure pain and my accident was in’95.Get some sea baths and do some dead sand excercises….that worked for me.
    They would like to chew me up but what I bring to the table none of them has and that is tolerance of anything or anyone foreign.There are many things I dont agree with in this world but until people realise that every man has a right to decide his own destiny, then there will always be others who want to shove their own opinions and beliefs down our throats.
    What I have noticed is that these so called christians rather condemn and ridicule any other beliefs or religions as oppose to open and respectful dialogue with them.
    Maybe with open dialogue then we could start to see (if possible or any)some sort of common ground,rather than this do as I say or die mentality from both sides.
    Personally I am not religious but what about the confused masses out there trying to find the truth,this would be a good chance for you all to do some good for your brotherman.

  8. Chase

    Akabozik:

    Not one ass will happen here in Barbados if the Nation publish the cartoons.

    Years ago maybe a steel donkey or a bacoo (if this is the right spelling).

    Let the Muslims go about their life in peace..NOT all are terrorist.

    Can anyone here tell me of any Bajan muslim they know for a Fact that speaks in favor terrorist activities?

    Why do we continue to stereotype?

  9. Take it easy guys. Those of you who are on the rock, have a duty not to let this BLP sponsored “Kite-flying” exercise, undermine or overtake the serious discussion and focus on the CWC disaster that has completely debilitated the Owen Arthur administration. I am busy and can’t attend to the actions that will be employed by these corrupt BLP vagabonds in an attempt to claw they way out of this electability black hole they have found themselves in.

    The timing of Ikeal’s article, the subject matter, The author himself are all suspiciously brought to bare in defense of this corrupt lot by broaching a highly controversial subject at this time. It is good to remember that he serves at the pleasure of the PM, and that he has to be mindful of his predecessor’s demise.
    Ikeal is a so called guardian of the truth, who is questioning establish religious dogma, suggesting that social constructionism is at the heart of what is implied in popular biblical stories and beliefs, and he does all this while professing to be a Sociologist Rastafarian. Modern day sociology can make no claim to truth, and I would refer Ikeal to Anne Hendershott’s book “The Politics of Deviance” The introduction gives the impartial reader a sense of what modern sociology and sociologist teaches and professes. Rastafarian-ism, well all would say about this belief system is that the great great grandson of Emperor Selassie on a visit to St. Lucia was very surprise to learn of the religion, need i say more? So folks the question isn’t if Ikeal is an authority to believe as he questions religious dogma in this manner it is on what grounds, in who’s name, and for what purpose is doing so now?

  10. Neil

    Am new to this site. Having read some of the past articles/blogs I am in agreement with many of the folk.
    Re: Ikael Tafari’s article, I stopped reading his diatribe a long time ago. Why do people like Chase, DMX et al take anything written by Tafari serious?
    Treat his writings like a comic book or just don’t read the garbage. His time is soon coming to an end like the party which runs the country.
    Ignore the man. By the way, is this the same white man who says that he is black? What should that tell you all?

  11. Chase

    Seeing that you are new Niel,just let me tell you this.The same way you took the time to chastise me and DFX, is the same way I write what I believe.
    Whether Tafari is right or wrong…..he has the right to his own beliefs and opinion.
    Just because you dont take it seriously,does not give you the right to tell others how to take it.
    I always come to the table with an open mind….that is how you learn….so since you are new…..buckle up and enjoy the ride.

  12. Rumplestilskin

    Hmm….note that some of what he says is not original, but previously legitimately researched.

    Read ‘The Messianic Legacy’. One of the subjects broached, based on ‘evidence’ which certain bloggers here are so quick to assert is necessary, despite their convenient refusal to accept fact when presented, is that Jesus was indeed one of a twin.

    That does not necessarily prove or disprove the crucifixion and the book quoted does not make such an assertion. But a valid point nevertheless.

    This, along with issues such as Jesus’s time in India are discussed, with evidence stated. Further discussed is the matter of the power of Jesus’s family. Possibly not the son of a poor carpenter but a powerful one, note that in those days carpentry was an honoured and much valued skill, and such a family may have wielded much political influence.

    Tell me, what man today could walk into a major trading ‘den/marketplace’ , throw around the wares in disgust at the profits being wrenched from the poor and walk out without immediate arrest and imprisonment?

    Only maybe two, Forde and Haynes.

    Anyone else would be arrested. What does that tell you about the comparative power that Jesus of Nazareth yielded? In those days they were not concerned that he was the Son of God but that he was against them and to them just another citizen.

    This notation does not belittle Jesus of Nazareth, but merely places his actions and existence in context.

    But, what is evidence properly researched against wilful and passionate ideas?

  13. Old Timer

    Neil:

    I hope you will enjoy these blogs. You will find one guy on here who professes to be oh, so gentle and peace-loving and blah blah, but he is one very angry, aggressive person, (probably drinks too much beer) who has insulted more than one person on this blog. I’ll leave you to discover who he is. But don’t mind me, I’m just an old timer, over the hills and down in the valley!

  14. P.T.Barnum

    reckon theres a good chance Jesus survived the ordeal, very nearly dying, but surviving, and with such medical assistance and care-giving as was available, was spirited out of the country, probably back to the same India he frequented as a horny teenager, surrounded by lotsa dark-eyed houri’s, lucky guy, never to return to war-torn Palestine, which remains war-torn Palestine to this day, two millenia later. Yes, it’s the world’s biggest con, the entire resurrection thing, but god how we love and adore it, couldn’t live without it. suckers abound and they like a good story, and boy this is it. besides, the whole sorry story was written not until sixty long years after it all happened, which gives the writers three whole generations for the exaggerations and embellishments to develop to incredible(literally!) proportions we so enjoy today. it’s show biz, baby!

  15. bajejun

    While I agree with you chase on freedom of beliefs, You are wrong when you try to chastise Christian as the ones who redicule, Try teaching Christiananity in China, India, any Muslim state or many more countries I can name, your fate will either be death or imprisonment, you may have a chip on your shoulder regarding Christiananity, thats your cross to bear, but show me the Christian country where persons with other beliefs are imprisoned or killed.

  16. Rumplestilskin

    Err where was it that Clinton had to send troops to save…Muslims from the Christians?

    Hmmm…

    Look, just accept that it takes all types in the world, whether Hebrew, Christian, Buddhist, Hidu, Muslim.

    There is bad and good in all.

    ‘Imagine….’

  17. Chase

    Bajejun:

    My apologies if my post upset you.You are quite right ..it is wrong for me to chastise christianity.
    I will chastise all religions.
    I thought I was doing this all along ……my mistake.
    I have no chip when it comes to christianity….nor do I have about any other religion.We all have to exsist on this small planet.
    All I ‘preach’ is tolerance…..and that goes for everyone regardless of religious affiliation.
    Could you imagine if we were to disect every religion on this earth and hate each other?

  18. DFX

    Chase,

    I notice that you like ya stirred up a hornets nest in here tonite. I can’t figure it out, if you anti-anything you seem to be a bad person, if you say everybody should have a fair deal, you are a bad person. If you believe in peace you are a bad person. Now if you like beer you are a bad person. LOL

    You willing to accept my nomination as the President of the Peace Loving, Beer Drinking, Bad Boy Club?

    People, Young Hutchinson is ENTITLED to his opinion. Chase and I may not agree with it, but we respect it is HIS opinion. Chase and I started out at opposite sides of the fence a while back. But I am pretty sure that even though we have not met in person yet, we will be friends for a long time.

    Check your history, religion has been the root cause of almost every war. Why? Because people will not/cannot accept that other can have a different opinion. But lets not forget that darkness is an absence of light, good is an absence of evil. With out one we cannot have the other. I prefer a world with an absence of war and hate. I’m sure Chase will agree with me on that.

    Peace

    DFX

    PS
    Neil

    It’s DFX not DMX. But I’m willing to change for his pay check any day

  19. noreligion

    its the same with all religions and their followers. they all want to impose their beliefs on the rest of us, they sit in judgement of others, they all attack other religions to validate themselves. give me the humanist who was posting earlier any day or someone like chase, straigh talk or dfx.
    why is what ikael writes of such importance that bfp has to constantly make it a headline?

    **********************

    BFP robert replies…

    Hi noreligion,

    We make it a headline because we find it appalling that Tafari is on the government payroll representing our fine country.

  20. noreligion

    u know what i think. bfp, kairofocus and likeminded posters probably get orgasms just thinking about islam, abortion, ikael, cuba, venezuela and race. only explanation for their obsession with the topics.
    i know i know. i will now be banned or told to go get my own blog. i know it only takes 15 minutes.

  21. Let us all remember that Ikeal Tafari is the same fellow who wrote that the world will end in 2012 when the poles shift.Let us then not take this ranting by a man who specialises in pointificating about obscure issues to heart.There are bigger issues at hand.Furthermore,BFP there is no need i think to drop to the level of making that comment about the muslim cartoons or to use the ravings of a borderline madman to push your vendetta against certain aspects of muslim culture, aspect which I might add are not seen to be prevalent among the Barbados muslim community

    **************************
    BFP Robert comments…

    Hi itsjustme,

    No one seems to be particularly upset about either Tafari’s rantings, or the fact that the Nation News published them, or that Tafari represents the Government of Barbados.

    There is clearly a double standard vis a vis the media’s treatment of Christianity vs Islam, and the public’s expectations. We merely ask “why?”

  22. samizdat

    No disrespect, noreligion, but from your comments so far I would have thought you’re just too insignificant to ban…

  23. Two Sides

    I really dont think that one should concern oneself on the lives or attributes of any of the messengers, Jesus, Mohammed or Guru Nanik but one should focus on the message…..which I think they all have in common….love, goodness and respect for our fellow man

  24. BFP

    BFP Robert comments…

    Hi itsjustme,

    No one seems to be particularly upset about either Tafari’s rantings, or the fact that the Nation News published them, or that Tafari represents the Government of Barbados.

    There is clearly a double standard vis a vis the media’s treatment of Christianity vs Islam, and the public’s expectations. We merely ask “why?”

  25. Rumplestilskin

    Two Sides. Bingo.

    Amen.

  26. liz

    I was taught to respect all religious beliefs.
    I thought that all Barbadians would have the common decency and good manners to respect the faiths of others.
    I was wrong.
    I mourn for what Barbadians are losing –
    good manners and respect for others.
    We are becoming a nation of savages.

  27. True Native

    Sorry Liz, but the whole world has changed. Not nice, I agree, but we have to face reality.
    Anyone seen the latest Micky Mouse video? It is being aired by Hammas (don’t they form part of the Palestinian Government? Please correct me if I’m wrong). Micky Mouse is teaching Muslim CHILDREN how to use AK47’s against Jews and Christians – the Infidels. The theme is all “kill, kill, kill.” There are those who will say, “Yes, but that’s only a fringe group” (who – Hammas??). So where are the voices of protest from the moderate, decent, peace-loving Muslims?

  28. DFX

    True Native,

    “So where are the voices of protest from the moderate, decent, peace-loving Muslims?”

    Maybe sitting next to the majority of Bajans that are sitting back and letting this country go to waste due to over spending. The few of us that come in here and speak our minds are sadly the minority. And while we might get a lil cuss up those boys out there will get a little shot up.

    But don’t worry, in a hundred years our ancestors will be sitting back reading about these times wondering what we were fighting for. Oh darn, sorry I forgot 2012 is just around the corner 😉

    Don’t let life stress you out people. It’s only temporary.

    DFX

  29. True Native

    You have a point there, DFX!

  30. yatinkinkiteasy

    Tafari Hutchinson still smoking sooooo much weed he cant figure out who he is, far less who Jesus was!
    Amen.

  31. P.T.Barnum

    this curious sentiment of “respecting people’s beliefs” I find a little strange. It is these beliefs that have us at war,now, ever since one belief(or extremists thereof) flew laden aircraft into bldgs of the other belief, while chanting allah’s/god’s name.
    wasn’t that nice of them?

    i now hold no respect for beliefs. i either know or i dont know – i have no time for idiot believing in fairy stories and other sentimental bs, i prefer rock solid knowledge, not what he or she “feels”.

    human beliefs are now a planetary scourge, capitalised upon by the various religions/churches, who seek to make said beliefs a money-spinnin business (with great success)
    i have zero time for cults based on a jesus-figure or a muhamed-figure, or for that matter buddha, confuscius or any other form of humanoid-ancestor worship, whether or not the message he (always a he) bore! – big deal.

    here’s another message. start thinking this belief bs thru,entirely, lest it get any worse, which i fear it shall. i just wish humanity, silly humanity would get over his childish need for imaginary psychological ‘support’ for their inculcated ‘problem’ of dying at the end of what is essentially a very nice life.
    it’s obvious we confuse the emotions of the death-spectators, with those of the death-participants.
    let’s examine those two perspectives. for death-participants, death is likely a sweet relief,no problems at all.
    for death-spectators,however, seeing someone die is a fairly awful event,and it tugs at our emotional heart strings(enter the church,cup in hand) and we thus think omg i don’t want to die.
    and yet when your time comes, you go with no problem at all.
    we badly need to get over our inculcated fear of death. – or do we enjoy it too much?

    NO-one is born with a fear of death. it is induced. we are all born with a healthy sense of self-preservation, but that is NOT the same thing as a fear of death.
    learn to separate the two and start thinking this whole matter thru, thoroughly.
    right now religions are ruining human civilization, over nothing more than a buncha beliefs?? are you SERIOUS about this krapola??
    get over your inculcations, put upon you by parents and churches and belief systems that seek to manipulate and control you to their own ends.
    time for serious introspection, and figuring out exactly what it is you are ‘believing’ in.
    it’s not real. you are studiously believing in something that’s NOT REAL.

  32. Adrian

    liz
    May 8th, 2007 at 11:10 am
    I was taught to respect all religious beliefs.
    I thought that all Barbadians would have the common decency and good manners to respect the faiths of others.
    I was wrong.
    I mourn for what Barbadians are losing –
    good manners and respect for others.
    We are becoming a nation of savages.
    ————————————————————–
    When did you realize this? When Liz Thompson brandish a cutluss in public forum for all to see. Playing proper is one thing, to LOOK, and more importantly act properly in all circumstances is indeed quite another. Inspite off the emotional clap trap you and others would want to bring to this, there is a glaring disparity in media coverage, of the two religions. The reality of modern christianity, and of the ancient Islam in modern times does not square with the clearly partisan commentry of todays media. Clearly one-sided. Right On BFP, they will never be able to answer for their stupidity.

  33. Chase

    P.T.Barnum:

    Boy I cant wait to see what Kairosfocus will say to this.

    DFXget ya beers out boy this topic look headed for a record haul.

  34. “… too insignificant to ban”.

    We have differing opinions on the importance of the individual.

    It would be easy to assume that with several posters in this forum, we would have vastly differing opinions across many of the major issues today… or would we?

    A speedy way to find out would be rational discussion. I invite you to consider this.

  35. noreligion

    rational discussion is not an option on this blog. if u don’t agree with the emotional, faith based rantings and diatribe then you get labelled an apologist, insignificant etc.

    chase the beers and more will be needed. p.t. barnum has stirred up a hornet’s nest. kairofocus will be on a wordy rampage today!

  36. DFX

    Chase,

    I notice that Kairo ain’t focus on this one yet. Or he preparing a long reply. I am truly looking forward to it when it comes.

    Even though we are the target of his name calling I still enjoy reading his replies as they are educational. Sad thing is that some people don’t realise in here is that even if I don’t believe your point of view, I have still gained an education from examining it.

    So keep up the good fight.

    DFX

  37. Chase

    DFX;
    Kairosfocus must really be taking his time to dot his I’s and cross his T’s.
    When it comes ,I bet it will be a masterpiece!
    I must admit though like you said his words makes for good reading,just that I dont think he will ever realise that some of us cant be bothered with religion.
    Maybe when I can get over the high cost of living,the bunch of crooks ruining my homeland,afford a piece of the rock……..then I might find time to look at religion.

  38. Chase

    noreligion:

    I agree with you 100%.That is the price people like us pay for bringing an alternative to the table,

  39. Chase

    DFX:

    Dont know if you can get out but Bajan Reporter just told me of a nice lime at Players at 8 pm.
    Lots of fun,beers and a generally good time.

  40. samizdat

    I think some of you have missed the point of this thread. I might be wrong, but as I understood it the BFP poster wasn’t so much taking a Christian apologist/anti-Muslim line as drawing attention to a cowardly lack of equity in how different religions are treated in the media.

    If fundamental tenets of Christian doctrine are going to be called into question (in my opinion, perfectly legitimately so) shouldn’t Islam – the other most powerful and influential world religion – be subject to a similar critique? And if not, why not?

    Isn’t that more or less what BFP is arguing here?

  41. Chase

    Samizdat:

    Puleeeaassee,BFP always take the anti-muslim line.
    Where have you been ?

  42. samizdat

    Incidentally…has BFP ever banned a poster simply for disagreeing with its perceived “obsessions” (noreligion’s term) with Ikael, cuba, race, etc etc? My sense is that – abusers, haters and racists aside – differing views aren’t just tolerated but are actively welcomed here, as long as they’re expressed with a modicum of intelligence.

    That’s why the idea of noreligion being banned for his (actually very mild) critical comments on BFP editorial policy seemed to me ridiculous…

  43. samizdat

    Maybe I don’t come here as often as some, Chase. But if BFP does always take the anti-muslim line, might that be a matter of trying to redress the balance? In other words, because it’s a line rarely if ever found in our mainstream media?

    What’s interesting is that this isn’t just a Bajan/Caribbean issue. My Brit friends tell me that this exact same debate is a very big deal in the UK at the moment…

  44. John

    samizdat
    May 9th, 2007 at 4:21 am
    I think some of you have missed the point of this thread. I might be wrong, but as I understood it the BFP poster wasn’t so much taking a Christian apologist/anti-Muslim line as drawing attention to a cowardly lack of equity in how different religions are treated in the media.

    If fundamental tenets of Christian doctrine are going to be called into question (in my opinion, perfectly legitimately so) shouldn’t Islam – the other most powerful and influential world religion – be subject to a similar critique? And if not, why not?

    Isn’t that more or less what BFP is arguing here?
    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    You think the Nation or the Advocate are crazy?

    Just as they keep in line on issues that might invite the wrath of the GOB, they will never go down the line of questioning the basic tenets of a religion other than Christianity.

    Quite apart from the fear factor, there is also a high level of ignorance of other religions which exist within their doors …. and outside.

    Has the Nation issued a disclaimer or does the Nation also subscribe to the ideas of Ras Ikael?

    Should the Nation publish articles arguably (or is it clearly) designed as an affront to the basic tenets of practising Christians?

    If the articles are indeed designed as an affront to practising christians, why not balance these articles with articles which are also an affront to our Muslim, Hindu or Rastafarian brothers?

    Personally the article does not bother me.

    As I have stated elsewhere I scan Ras Ikael’s writings more for amusement than anything else.

    …. however if I were a devout Christian, serious about every aspect of my religion and ignorant of the author’s constant efforts to shock and offend, I would be higly offended.

    Then again, maybe Ras Ikael may see some articles as offensive to his religion and is using his space as a vehicle to somehow get back.

    Maybe it is a majority, minority thing and Ras Ikael is merely asking us to stop and think?

    Maybe we should stop and think!

    But then isn’t Ras Ikael a highly educated man who is quite capaple of saying what he thinks?

    Maybe he needs to stop and think too!

  45. samizdat

    Incidentally, one obsession of BFP’s left out of noreligion’s list is cricket. I once posted a comment on another thread saying that our national/regional bitching about Windies’ current lack of success at cricket is unhealthy, demeaning and pathetic, and can be read as a sign of an immature and impoverished culture that feels it has too little else to be proud of, to validate its sense of identity and worth.

    And I’m still not banned.

    Yet…

  46. John

    … maybe it is that nobody is listening to anybody.

  47. samizdat

    John
    May 9th, 2007 at 4:57 am
    … maybe it is that nobody is listening to anybody.

    Hence the vital importance of a site like this, John. Because we are listening to each other, and exchanging opinions…

  48. John

    Agreed!!!

  49. Rumplestilskin

    Of course it is fine to analyse a religion from one’s viewpoint.

    And I agree further that all religions should be treated equally. Which is why no one should ‘go off the deep end’ when evidence and fact is presented either way.

    In terms of the comparative presentation of religion in the press, I disagree and believe that contrary to your own thoughts, Islam is very often prsented in a negative light in the Western press.

    Now I am not Muslim, but I can sit back and calmly reason what is fair and just.

    The one problem arises when ‘bigotry’ is presented as analysis i.e. those attacking a particular religion themselves refuse to accept pertinent facts generally and take comparative presentation of their own religion, which is valid matter in analysis, and refuse to acknowledge these.

    This sends off an alarm bell of where the presenter and critic is coming from and the word ‘bigotry’ comes into play.

    Criticism is fine, but when a particular line is constantly and stubbornly taken such bigotry is evident.

    Bigotry arises from someone’s own insecurities or hates. Its like a cancer. And if someone takes that line with, for example Islam, what is the next candidate for assault? Judaism, Buddhism?

    One has to be careful.

  50. True Native

    Rumplestilskin:

    Oh, how I wish everything worked the way you suggest it should. What you fail to realise is that Christians, Jews, Hindus, Buddhists and people of other religions are dead scared of Muslims. Do you ever hear, or read of Christian/Jewish/Hindu/Buddhist CHILDREN (never mind the adults!) being taught to use AK47’s, swords and other weapons to kill anyone who is not of their religious persuasion, and being taught to become suicide bombers? A twelve year old boy was recently used as a suicide bomber. So, what are we left to think? “Oh, ca-dear, give them a break, they’re really peaceful people – it’s just the fanatics” Yes, the fanatics – like the Irish Catholics and Protestants, killing each other throughout Ireland for decades. But hold on. They have come to their senses and have stopped the bloodshed and now the Sinn Fein and the Irish Protestants are sharing the Government. I am asking again – where are the voices of the “peace-loving Muslims” when atrocities take place, if they don’t go along with it. Don’t hold your breath!

  51. P.T.Barnum

    when we are little children, our parents lie to us.

    lie #1: Santa Claus. it’s all fun of course, but jolly old st.nick comes around annually with lotsa loot, and it’s good to see their little eyes light up,etc.
    lie #2. Easter bunny. ditto.
    lie #3. Tooth fairy. monetary recompense for the pains and humiliations of dental replacement.
    lie #4. Heaven/hell/death/god stuff. omg here come the inevitable questions…what happened to that dog lying at the side of the road,Mum? etc etc. and the response is the usual indoctrination about the alleged un-desirability of death, about being a good child,so you get to go to heaven and not that other place, and sit at the r.hand of god yadda yadda yadda.

    This goes all very well and nice until around the age of eight, when the fantasy peels away to reveal the various hoaxes, and Messrs. Claus, Bunny and Fairy (a law firm?) lose much credibility,and we are left with that last remaining lie..you know.. the one about heaven and hell and death and god.

    THAT lie must be perpetuated at all costs,my child, after all that’s how we’ll control you for the rest of your life, via fear.
    Goddammit, my parents and grandparents abused me with this crap, and now it’s my turn to lovingly hand it down to you too, my child..
    Here: hold this bag of bricks for the rest of your life, let it screw up your head with psycho-fantasy of a world beyond this one, and promises of that most disgusting and abhorent of diets ..milk and honey.
    who the hell invented THAT torture??

    if you think about it, i mean really really THINK about it, there is no basis for believing in an escape mechanism for the death function we so love to hate. no-one ever came back from the grave to confirm this alleged afterlife that we’ve built an entire business empire around.
    an entire business empire? what am i saying?!!! this is heresy! this is simply awful..that anyone can expose our deepest ingrained emotional BS in such a frank and honest manner.

    I suggest humanity have a long hard rethink on exactly why we subject our children to a lifetime of adult insecurities, born of thousands of years of deliberate intentional brainwashing-ourselves with this cute little headgame called believing in something that iznt real,
    to the point where some among us get entirely bent outa shape, and start doing seeerious kent like chopping up others, roadside bombs, Crusades, Crusades II, 9/11, take your pick of ‘delightful’ global-anti-social behaviours.

  52. you

    Objectivity and level-headedness aside.

    Abuse by a few users of BFP, as above, is uncalled for. When writers, with no justification, use other posters’ names as whipping posts, I have to object to it.

    It is written contribution such as this that BFP should moderate out as spam.

    To quote kairos, as “point in question”:
    I am not kairos; I am someone else, trying to show some of the writers in this blog that the plank resides elsewhere.

    All religions, including rastafarianism, which is what the thread above may concern, since it is Mr. Tafari, should agree that polite, concerned dialogue is HEALTHY.

    However, a thread is not to be used by sadists as material. So I am asking BFP a question about Abuse and particularly in relation to a couple of the posters above: whether ‘the use of abuse’ is allowable as a part of the formum of discussion?

  53. Old Timer

    “Where are the voices of the peace-loving Muslims?” Are you kidding? They’re too scared to speak out. Have you forgotten what happened to Salman Rushdie?

  54. Anonymous

    Islam is a religion of suppression.

    Indeed…ask Rushdie!!

    ask their ever-veiled women, so completely suppressed they can’t even acknowledge the fact they are virtual-possessions of their chauvinistic 7th.century men.

    But it’s not just Islam!
    MOST religions are about suppression, starting with suppression of the individual intellect, requiring the participant to “believe in” a book. – A BOOK!

    Hello? is this for me? a free thinking free spirit?
    – I DON’T THINK SO !

    Your 18th.century ‘product’ now has zero appeal to this 21st.century marketplace, apart from those few in need of ‘support’ (females?)

  55. samizdat

    I think the key distinction is between moderates and fundamentalists. The latter have closed minds. They have no interest in discussion. It’s pointless trying to argue with them because their beliefs are cast in stone, and they know that they are right and you are wrong.

    This distinction applies as much to non-believers as believers. On this thread, for example, P.T.Barnum is clearly a fundamentalist. He wants us all to ‘think’ about the fraudulence of organized religion, but actually – and comically enough – much of what he says is about what he passionately ‘believes’. He’s no different from any other ‘true believer’: just that he’s on the other side of the fence. Atheistic zealotry is as fundamentally (pun intended) flawed (and ultimately as irrational) as the most orthodox Christian’s or Muslim’s, because it’s obsessed with trying to prove the unproveable.

    Incidentally, Barnum, have you read Richard Dawkins’ The God Delusion? If you haven’t, you should get hold of a copy. It’s a lucidly-written, powerful, angry polemic against religion. You’d probably love it. It might even become your Bible…:)

    As for other comments here: Old Timer makes a valid point, I think…

  56. Diaspora-ite

    DFX wrote:
    “Check your history, religion has been the root cause of almost every war.”
    Not so! The root cause of almost every war in history has been land and the possession thereof. Religion may have been used as a convenient pretext, but it’s all about land.

    As for the one who writes that he/she believes in “tolerance,” remember the words of G. K. Chesterton who wrote that “Tolerance is the position of the person who believes in NOTHING.” As Bob Dylan sang many years ago, “Ya gotta serve somebody; it may be the Devil, or it may be the Lord, [or it may even be yourself], but ya gotta serve somebody. So let us dispense with these ideological/secular/non-religious platitudes and call it for what it is, a religious agenda designed to denigrate Christianity and to promote Rastafari.

    Ikael Tafari has been given a bully-pulpit by the Nation, and the government, and he is using it masterfully to further his own agenda. Pass another spliff, time for more anti-Christian inspiration!

  57. you

    The message is that there are some (probably quite young) posters who are posting demeaning comments, insulting things, and not taking the time to actually carefully read and study what such person is saying.

    Person referred to did not even make a comment on this thread. That is abuse, and hopefully those persons will now take their time, possibly be a bit less impetuous, and use logic based refutations.

    Back-reading concludes that persons are wel-educated, so there is no reason to fight this further.

    One lives in the hope of a better blog?

    And, for the record, love to all; every religion, every accepting, and peaceful-meaning, belief.

  58. Warrior

    Chase your mind so open it seems like your brain fall out.

    You want us to believe that you come to the table with an open mind yet you want to tell Niel that he does not have to right to tell anyone what to think.

    And what it is that you doing with the big lotta ignernt talk that you always on here with.

    With all this talk one thing must be said, it better to have Jesus and don’t need him than to cock up and dead and then realise that you do. stussssssppppppeeeeeeeeeeeee.

    If my mother heard that stupse she would tell me that I was pulling down my brain. Chase you like you stuspe too much.

  59. ...sigh

    sorry for the late post knowing that nothing has been said in 2 days.
    you people are actually quite funny.

    few things;
    right at the begining someone said something to the extent of “try to preach christianity in india, china or any muslim country and see what happens” they then said they knew of no christian country that did what those countries would to other religions. true there is no christian country that would, simply because there are no christian countries. the countries that person refers to are in fact secular countries, america, britian, canada, barbados, etc. remember the separation of church and state people. theses countries are also democracies (whatever those are) and this is why there is no persecution or outlawing of other religions, its because of the basic principle of democracy which allows us all our own opinions. the other countries are however not democricies and the “church” and state are still very much connected therefore other religions are not just an opposing view point but can be called acts of treason.

    wondering why i spent so much time on that point? because it is the root of the argument to some extent. the diparity in the media position with regard to christianity and islam, well there is no clear cut answer, but remeber that the media’s treatment of islam in all of these “christian” countries is anything but good and is also anything but rational. the cartoon incident merely adds wood to the fire. by removing the cartoons the media actually added to the plight of the muslims, how? remeber the media is constantly reporting of the atrosities of the muslims inb the middle east and their suicide bombings are usually the highlight because thats the part we cant relate to, the christian countries send soldiers to fight with hope of return, suicide bombers are already dead when the leave so we automatically cant relate. of course this is not the image of all followers of islam, but the media is to has to keep us and the “enemy” as dissimilar as possible. so the non radical everyday muslims are getting pressure from any and everyone from the media and then you put a bomb on their spiritual leaders head…it angers them , the obviously ask for it to be removed, the normal thing to be doen would be for the press to leave it, thanks to freedom of speech but the remove it, which now gets the already anti-muslim masses more anti muslim because they appear to be getting preferential treatment in the media. so by removing it the muslim plight is worsened rather than releived.

    how does that refer in any way to the thread.?
    christianity is the fundemental religious belief of the modern West, and democracy ( the brainchild of the modern west) provides for anything in majority to be questioned and scrutinised my the minority, and since human nature generally leads us to change and want for something differnt we usually go after the most obvious thing, ie the majority in this case christianity, this is why you will find more direct challenges to christianity in the press, like blondie dred’s ” jesus was a twin thing” if you very observant people will however notice, the media is generally way more in support of its majority (as it has to be) the facade of freedom of speech and a level playing gield for all opinions that the sections by tafari (blondie dred) and others creates is nothing more than a tool to keep you relatively happy and faithful in your obviously flawed, but more so than you usually notice, life system.

    i shouldnt say flawed i should say rather” complicated

    BFP….lol joke this is not an avenue for riviting and inspirational discussion or paradigm shifting ideology this is another way for you to enjoy the facade of democracy and your freedom to opinion (noone actually cares what you say here)

    youall know of marx, he said that philosophers interpret the world around them in various ways, which is what yuo all do, give each other your interpretations of the world ( not really anything mind blowing btw i’m 20 and havent seen anything in this whole long entire thread that i have not seen or head before and at 20 i should not find myself ina place where i can summarise the discussion before reading it) anyways according to marx you are all philosophers, or at least the mouth pieces for a philosopher since i noticed some of you just repeated the opinion of other people. But Marx also went on to say that ” the point is not to interpret the world but to change it”

    and it hasnt yet.

    personally i dont quite agree with Marx but i havent fully developed my opinion on that

  60. Yardbroom

    …sigh
    It is nice to be young and have Marxist, Leninst, or Sociological theories, it is even better to air them in student debates, but the world is a hard place.

    As regards Marx it has never worked any where, but the cop out to that is that true Marxism has not been tried.

    Seek and ye shall find, good luck!

  61. Rumplestilskin

    sigh, fair points on the whole western thing.

    Regarding the ending, you are incorrect on one issue that you mention with two phrases ”(noone actually cares what you say here) and ” the point is not to interpret the world but to change it and it hasnt yet.”

    When the cages of those that have the daily power (both in political power and business) are being rattled enough to express views one way or the other it provides evidence that both of the above phrases and then conclusion, are untrue.

    Sometimes it takes experience to spot certain subtle things, but I can tell you that this blog is at the least rattling many cages.

    THAT is the point of the blog in the first place.

  62. Chase

    Warrior:

    Please read my post before you make silly comments.
    What I said to Niel was in context with what he said.

    If what I writes offend you ….you have the option of not reading but thanks for reading my posts anyhow.

    The thing is …..when I die ,I do just that…die!
    I hope you are ready……..

  63. Jerome Hinds

    Let us all read……CAREFULLY….. page 8 of the Nation News 13th August 2007 !

    Ikael Tafari publicly takes a turn in David Commissiong !

    Talking ‘ bout a house divided among itself !

    Wuh loss……it is the 13th of the month !

    Black Monday….if you ask me !

  64. Anonymous

    i tired of I. Tafari and Commie anyhow…they just helping the $ man by blowing smoke up and down Barbados so the rest of us cannot see what been happening for more than the last decade.
    And people acting like they don’t know why I.T. got a gov gig..hahahahaa
    Separation of church and the state? Who came up with that…haven’t u heard Owen Arthur and George Dubya? Owen was congratulating Barbados on being sooooo very Christian late last year at some public event and Dubya always bringing religion into everything. Seperation?
    eh heh

  65. Watchman

    What else would you expect from someone who, in 1986 in the Law Lecture theatre at UWI, Cave Hill, “prophesied” that RONALD WILSON REAGAN was the anti-christ! He stated during a lecture on Rastafarianism in a Sociology class that “Reagan” means “Little Horn” or “Little King” and with six letters in each name….. 666, was the one spoken of in the Book of Revelations.
    Furthermore, Reagan, the anti-christ was going to reveal himself to the world before his “death”. The Pope, “The Beast”, and Reagan, “Anti-Christ”, were wounded by the “same deadly sword”, a gun, and both recovered …as Revelations state they would. Remember that both were shot? Thus, Tafari linked the two together.
    One of the ways to prove the truth/authenticity of a prophet is his ability to proclaim prophecies and for all to see evidence of such prophecies coming to past. TAFARI IS A FALSE PROPHET! Reagan died not even “knowing his head from his foot” and never proved himself to be what Tafari “prophesied” he was!

  66. Michael Swann

    If you are a Christian, then surely you should forgive him?